Is NHRA out of touch? (1 Viewer)

Ok I have told myself 10 times not to make this an anti countdown rant :) I will try

-undo the testing ban. Right now the nhra takes the big show to what 20 or 21 locations a year. We are a sport that is so much better if witnessed in person. Allow testing but only at match races, this would allow the little guys to earn the money (and learn more) that they need to race on the circuit and more importantly it brings the product to the people. The guy sitting in Oklahoma, Maine, Mississippi or North Dakota doesn't have a race anywhere near them so there is nothing to get them hooked. Bring a show to them and perhaps you get them hooked. Kinda like drag racing missionaries.

-lower ticket prices. I have a friend that is willing to come try out a race but can't see paying the big ticket price on something that he's not all the sure that he will like.

-I can live with turning on ESPN and seeing the event before going into overtime which has caused racing to be delayed but flipping it on to see the 4th quarter just starting is just wrong. Granted not nhra's fault but if they are paying the bills for the coverage then the need to fix this.

-Spread the TV love, I like seeing Force be all mental as well as the next person but there is a point where ForceTV has to be limited.

-Paul Page is a great announcer for Indy car. His style and pace is better suited for a marathon race such as the 500. His skill set is not being properly used here. Put Reif or Reinhardt in that seat. The two people doing the TV are the ambassadors of the sport and it needs to be a priority. Dunn does a great job.

-ok the c-down. Very quickly, it hasn't worked. Nascars numbers dropped and so have ours. Yes the butts in the seats are due to the economy but they were dropping before the economy tanked and after the cdown came in. Ratings should have gone up but haven't. When you barely have 10 TF cars able to run the full schedule is it really a big deal to have a cut off.....Ok I will stop

-Keep pit access, the closeness that fans can get to the drivers is a major selling point

-there is so much more that can be done with audiocast

-ND is great but old. Make it a weekly with weekly info. I used to get sports illustrated. It came every Thrursday and had Sunday's events in it. having pro results delayed a week and sportsmen even longer than that is crazy.

- A few weeks back they did a profile on Alexia during the broadcast. Do more of that, show sportman racers. Let the non hard core fan know that there is more to it. There is a big disconnect going on. I have been stunned when I race my car how many of the younger crowd that are in the lanes getting ready to race have no idea about NHRA. On the flip side, let the person watching the coverage know that there is more racing out there at their local track. Race their street car go see the match race shows I mentioned before. They have to sell more then just the 24 races a year in order to get complete buy in from the consumer.

-Perhaps the most important of all, go to Bader bootcamp. Head to Norwalk and let the people there show how to a) put on a show b) treat fans like they are wanted c) give fans what they want for one helluva price d) treat racers good e) give sponsors their moneys worth and so on.
 
Better yet, get all the know-it-alls, chronic complainers, keyboard crew chiefs, second-guessers, name-droppers and suck-ups that post on the Nitro Whiner to run the NHRA.

Rice, Krogen and I are ready to take over just hand us the keys :)
 
It's not that NHRA has lost touch it just that everything is so different now that the flavor we once enjoyed is gone and there is a change in society, less disposable income, and more media options.

On top of that, there isn't much night racing anymore, the flames don't dance in the headers when the cars are idling, no more popcorn popping sound, no dry hops, no memorable named cars like he Blue Max or the Hawaiian. It seemed like it all died after Orange County went a way. In other words the nitro cars aren't as exciting to watch as they were in those you tube clips.

Revell models, magazines, the mongoose and Snake type promotions are few and far between. No Bill Doner ads, very little out reach from racers, drivers camping out in the trailer, the same old look and feel at every track with the same players! No wonder there are problems. Those in the sport need to be aggressive!

I'm doing all I can on my end and our local track, Woodburn has given me special coupons that are good for 5.00 off at any major race this year. We got them kind of late in the year but i'm confident this will work, locally anyway and I gave out a bunch yesterday. On a local radio station we have contests. The ads say "When you hear the Captiol Auto Group KYKN dragster be the first person to call ......for a free pair of tickets". Then some time during the day you hear the burnout and you call.

When we're not racing we are displaying the car and we do a lot of them. We are even promoting a big outdoor car show with none other than Ed the Outlaw Jones on Sept. 3. At that show we will cross promote the Fall Classic.

We did a great show yesterday and while there were some older folks checking out our car we attracted a lot of young families. They are the key and NHRA needs to figure out a way to market to them. And once they get them there they need to be entertained so they will be back.
 
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Just for the heck of it, here's some of my ideas for changing NHRA...for what it's worth, which isn't much.

1. Get rid of the the suits that came from the dog food company and know nothing of drag racing or its history.

2. Stop making every sponsor "The Official _____ of NHRA" and not allow a competitor to sponsor cars in the sport.

3. Change the testing ban so cars and run booked-in races and make extra money, then perhaps allowing more cars to run more events.

4. Notice that there aren't many butts in the seats and lower the admission prices (should have been a no brainer).

5. Lower the suits salaries, which are way too high for the knowledge they have.

6. Make each track conform to the same standard for sand traps and netting.

7. Get some employees in place who actually understand drag racing. Drag racing facilities don't run like a normal business, nor should they be advertised that way.

8. Get rid of the ESPN coverage and Paul Page and get a network where you have SET air time. Get announcers who have lots of knowledge that can have fun with the coverage.

9. Listen to you racers, many of whom have engineering degrees and are much smarter than most of the suits. Let them help create solutions to problems without the knee-jerk reactions we usually get, most of which do nothing but cost the racers more money without really solving the problem.

OK, off my sopa-box. Fire away!

#2 would be a Huge start in itself!!!
 
Joe I'm with you - #2 on that list might be a good start.

I don't pretend to have any answers, but it seems like heads (not egos) should come together to ensure the future of a "quality" NHRA. An NHRA that keeps it's fans and attracts new ones at a modest clip.
 
Just for the heck of it, here's some of my ideas for changing NHRA...for what it's worth, which isn't much.

1. Get rid of the the suits that came from the dog food company and know nothing of drag racing or its history.

2. Stop making every sponsor "The Official _____ of NHRA" and not allow a competitor to sponsor cars in the sport.

3. Change the testing ban so cars and run booked-in races and make extra money, then perhaps allowing more cars to run more events.

4. Notice that there aren't many butts in the seats and lower the admission prices (should have been a no brainer).

5. Lower the suits salaries, which are way too high for the knowledge they have.

6. Make each track conform to the same standard for sand traps and netting.

7. Get some employees in place who actually understand drag racing. Drag racing facilities don't run like a normal business, nor should they be advertised that way.

8. Get rid of the ESPN coverage and Paul Page and get a network where you have SET air time. Get announcers who have lots of knowledge that can have fun with the coverage.

9. Listen to you racers, many of whom have engineering degrees and are much smarter than most of the suits. Let them help create solutions to problems without the knee-jerk reactions we usually get, most of which do nothing but cost the racers more money without really solving the problem.

OK, off my sopa-box. Fire away!
I don't think #3 would bear the fruit most Maters believe ... think about it, in the 2-3 years just prior to the testing rule can somebody tell me the number of actual match races (other than Nowalk) where NHRA National event caliber Nitro cars were booked in? I suspect it is a very low number in the overall scheme. Its not like a bunch of Nitro teams were booking 5 events a year all around the country as a revenue stream. I know there may have been a couple, but they were rare and I am talking big picture. Quality match racing days have loooong since ended (Ahhh the good ole days). I would also venture to guess that many tracks would tell you the price for a booked match race is too high and doesn't provide as much ROI as everyone thinks.

For that matter, if match racing was allowed without penalty ... how many teams do you think would actually be in the market. They face the same ROI concerns as any track. "What is an acceptable fee to run my car at your track to cover my expenses plus travel"?
 
As far as attracting a younger audience ,I am afraid to say that Mr. Feld's IHRA format is probably much closer than NHRA's vision or lack of.... Short duration, thrill packed, "wowee" venues will most likely win out over the day long "shake and bake" NHRA style racing especially in the 18-35 crowd.... OR.... like the "sock-hops" of the 50-60's this sport is doomed and nothing you do can save it from it's own demise. Like someone else said kids today just think of cars as another appliance...a means to get from point A to point B. There is no "love-affair" with today's car.

Jack, you have hit the nail directly on the head with your last statement---there is no "love affair" with today's car. Nobody writes songs about Toyotas and Hyundais. The car is just an appliance in most of the younger generation's life---just something to get you from point A to point B. We didn't have DVD's, CD's, ipods, cell phones that do everything, lap top computers, Twitter, Facebook, hundreds of cable TV stations in HD, video games, and dozens of other things to occupy our time---we just had our cars. Like it or not, everything changes---nothing remains the same.
 
I don't know if any of you have noticed yet, but this thread has been going on for some time now, (70 posts) and has been pretty interesting to read. If you go back, and follow it, you'll notice a huge divergence of opinions on what it will take to "make things right" again.

Everything from "go back to the way it was in the 70's "(Nostalgia) to "Monster Jam/Night Of Fire/WWF type events with rocket cars and stunt shows", to "bring in the tuners, sport bike stunt riders and gang bangers because that's what the young crowd wants to see" to "leave it alone, it's the economy."

Then, throw in the face that the current crop of owners and racers are loathe to change anything for fear of losing any edge they may have, real or imagined.

We all have our own ideas on what it's going to take to get the crowds back into the gate, and we're pretty convinced that our way is "the way." Of course, eveyone else thinks we're nuts.

Not so easy or simple a thing to do, it would seem.......
 
I don't think #3 would bear the fruit most Maters believe ... think about it, in the 2-3 years just prior to the testing rule can somebody tell me the number of actual match races (other than Nowalk) where NHRA National event caliber Nitro cars were booked in? I suspect it is a very low number in the overall scheme. Its not like a bunch of Nitro teams were booking 5 events a year all around the country as a revenue stream. I know there may have been a couple, but they were rare and I am talking big picture. Quality match racing days have loooong since ended (Ahhh the good ole days). I would also venture to guess that many tracks would tell you the price for a booked match race is too high and doesn't provide as much ROI as everyone thinks.

For that matter, if match racing was allowed without penalty ... how many teams do you think would actually be in the market. They face the same ROI concerns as any track. "What is an acceptable fee to run my car at your track to cover my expenses plus travel"?


The year that Wilk was the best all season he did several match races. I go to Martin every year and watch a Funny Car Nationals where pros are. I know the world series of drag racing books in pro's. There are others as well. Now it might not be the Shoemacher and Forces of the world that would jump on this but Wilkerson did many of these, I would think the Pedregons would look at this as a possible means to earn more money and the list could go on
 
My Divisional Experience This Weekend

We had an interesting weekend in Spokane for a Divisional race. Due to management changes the race was added only in the last month or two. But despite that, Friday and Saturday evenings were packed. Largest crowds I've seen at a divisional, ever. We had a hard time finding a place to sit. Clearly the management had done some promo and it worked.

And it was an enthusiastic crowd cheering and standing on every pass. Mostly families with young kids. All had brought or bought food and were there for the duration.

But it was also quite telling to me. It was qualifying. They were cheering and arguing with each other about who would "win" each pair. In bracket classes (like TD and TS). They didn't understand a second of it. They eagerly watched the Super classes, but were completely confused. And never once did the announcer explain anything. He just announced cars and times, and oohed and aahed over the pretty cars.

In the pits we were inundated with people wanting to understand. We had two dozen interactions with people teaching them bracket/index racing. Several returned the next day, and clearly appreciated what they had seen, and offered their support and encouragement. They just needed to understand, and no one was helping them.

The "Old Boy's Network"

This is a very long way to get around to saying: NHRA is an "old boy's network", in many senses of the phrase:

- The prime audience is graying, and it doesn't seem like anyone is reaching out to the younger audience. I don't personally like rice burners, but I'm in my 50s. 90% of kids today have/had them as their first cars. We have to embrace them. They enjoy racing them on the street, we have to embrace them racing on the strip.

- The management is the poster-child of an "old boy's network". The board is gray and grayer, filled with old-time insiders who have zero accountability to anyone but each other. Time to open it up, either make it elected or at least shine a light on it and blow in at least 50% new blood.

- It's a complex sport, where you seem to just have to know what's going on. That's OK in baseball or football where everyone learns it in preschool, but it's not OK in a fringe sport. And it's a confusing sport with dozens of classes and formats. Every race announcer should have evangelism and education as their number one priority. And NHRA should provide them with scripts, and the track with free promotional literature, explaining the sport in detail. NHRA is and should be about promoting the sport first, the sponsors will follow soon enough.

- It's a closed network. It's just not clear to anyone how to get involved. We decided we wanted to race, and after we pushed our way in the door, we were welcomed with open arms. But no one was saying "come on in, the water's fine!" Instead, to the fan NHRA racing looks like a bunch of people doing this very wild car show, and it's not clear how they would take part.

Participation is Growth

Participation is what makes sports big. Every child in America knows how to play baseball, has an opportunity to play, and knows how to get from their little league team to college to the minors to the pros. Golf is huge, with numbers that are staggering, in participation and fan involvement. Soccer is massive worldwide because anyone/everyone can play. The World Cup is the largest viewed event on the planet. NASCAR got big because the cars looked just like Bubba's daily driver, and Bubba could imagine rubbing fenders with Dale. In Europe auto racing is huge because there are classes that you can start taking your daily driver out in, and work up from there. And those numbers bring money and advertisers.

Sport is about competition, sure, but it's much more about "hell, I could do that". Anyone can play baseball, basketball, golf, tennis, and so on. But it's not clear to anyone I know how you do drag racing. How you get from driving your new-old Camaro to running Comp Eliminator? Most don't know. Heck, I don't think I do...

A significant part of NHRA should be promoting participation, and helping people climb the ladder from "get off the street at a grudge night" to "race your street car in some street legal class" to "build a dedicated race car for some faster class" and once on that path up through those classes to alky to the pros and so on. Junior dragsters are cool, and were a great idea. But many kids don't get into cars until they're 16 and can drive. By then, JRs just look like toys.

It's about "The Customer"

NHRA started life as a way to get people doing it, legally and safely. The "customer" was the participant. Somewhere along the line it got converted into a way to make money. And the "customer" became the fan. Now today, the "customer" is the sponsor. As anyone with a business will tell you, if your number one goal is making money, you don't. Your number one goal has to be satisfying customers, from whom you make money.

Sponsors don't want to be NHRA's customers, they want access to NHRA's customer. And that requires NHRA to understand who its customers are. In a world with a million media/entertainment choices, trying to get "fans" is silly and futile. The best fans are the participants and their friends/family. Make more participants, you make a bigger market. Even if that participation is only the rooting on of friends/family, or even simply the faint hope that I could/would do it some day.

The Circus vs. The Sport

The HD Partners acquisition was on the right track. Separate the traveling circus from the real sport. MLB is not baseball, there are only 30 organizations in the world doing baseball at that level. But there are millions of people who own a glove and play catch. Same is true for the PGA vs. the bulk of the golf market. Or FIA and soccer. Or...

NHRA needs to be about the sport. Not about the traveling circus. The circus is just the top echelon. The meat is down in the middle of the sport with the 30,000+ licensed drivers.

Take a cue from baseball. There is an organization (MLB) that runs and promotes the professional game. There are organizations that manage and run the next level down (minors/college). And then there is Little League, that is all about safe, fun participation in the sport.

I don't care if the name "NHRA" follows through to the circus (because it has name recognition) or if it goes back to its roots. But it's clear the organization that is NHRA today doesn't understand how to both run the circus and promote the sport. It was never clearer to me than to watch, in person, Mark Niver die and have the NHRA completely frozen for hours. Unable to say anything to the crowd or on TV because it was running the entertainment business, but also unable to tell the family and the racers anything for hours because it was no longer the racer safety organization.

Let Compton and crew run the circus. But give the sport back to the participants. Where it can be fed and grow. And create the real "next generation" of racers, for generations to come.

A Clear Vision

I've managed huge organizations, and taught others how to do it. It all starts with a clear, simple, well understood, and extremely well communicated vision. NHRA needs a new, clear vision. I propose:

To promote the safe participation in the fastest motorsport in the world.

And drive everything toward that end. Get more people involved, teach them from day one how it works and how to be successful, and make sure they can do it safely. Hire people with that goal, fire people who don't make that happen, and make every decision with these objectives in mind.

That's my plan. Pretty simple. Decide on a direction and go there.
 
I like your ideas in the old boys network area. I know I have explained to many newbies the details (or at least as detailed as they want) about the classes. Personally I enjoy doing that but I can't talk to everyone lol
 
I like your ideas about the participation driven sport. Which NHRA has been for a long time and I've spoken to several maters here about it and I'll say it again...if I wasn't doing it, I wouldn't be a fan. I don't go to spectate and if we are out of competition, you'll usually find me out of the event. I rarely get out of my pit unless I have friends/maters to meet or business to attend to on the midway.

What has gotten me for a long time is the fact that many maters on here and fans in the stand don't feel that sportsmen racers have a place at the national event level. So some of the fans don't appreciate the fact that it is a participant driven sport.

Sportman racers are more accessible, more friendly and more of what drag racing 'used to be' in the family friendly atmosphere. It's not uncommon to see entire families getting the car prepped for the next round with children who are of age helping out where they can, or at least where they feel useful.

It's also not uncommon to see a bunch of kids tailing along thier racing parents without them being shut up in the pit because of the parent's sponsor obligations. The fact that I see some of these pros kids in miniture racing uniforms is a little weird because I've seen them strip the kids of the uniform as soon as the camera cuts away.

The kids who race the juniors are helped out by their siblings and usually have a pretty good work ethic, are proud to show of their cars, helmets, etc.

I'm glad I'm in the sportsman ranks because there is more family, more friends, more fun, and THAT'S the best part of NHRA.
 
Christopher Williams makes many excellent points. Only thing I would add is that along with the complexity of drag racing is also the cost---same thing in NASCAR and most any other motorsport. Granted, you can still race your street car at lots of local tracks, but once you advance, its gets significantly more expensive than a glove and bat. Kind of the same thing that happened in the muscle car market---hard for your average 25 year old to afford to buy a $40K 69 Camaro to drive. That market remains a lot GREY, just like he refers to the drag racing market. Not sure that will ever change.
 
Christopher Williams makes many excellent points. Only thing I would add is that along with the complexity of drag racing is also the cost---same thing in NASCAR and most any other motorsport. Granted, you can still race your street car at lots of local tracks, but once you advance, its gets significantly more expensive than a glove and bat.

Mike, the point is that it's not that expensive to get started. Or not as expensive as most people think. When I tell people that I spent less on my whole operation (turnkey car, trailer, tools, parts, etc) than many people spend on a new car they can't believe it.

Right now, the "Complete Drag Racing Cars" section on RacingJunk.com as 1245 cars listed, about 1/2 of them are less than $25k. Yes, that's not cheap, but it's not out of reach for a lot of people. Many people spend MUCH more than that on boats, ATVs, or other toys.

And people would know that if NHRA's job was to scream "come on in, the water's fine".
 
What has gotten me for a long time is the fact that many maters on here and fans in the stand don't feel that sportsmen racers have a place at the national event level. So some of the fans don't appreciate the fact that it is a participant driven sport.

I am a pure fan. I don't have the time or money to race myself.

When I go to a race, I want to see the fastest, quickest, loudest, most spectacular cars run the quarter mile. I want to be blown away and think "damn that was wild!" after a fuel car makes a pass. I would think that's what the majority of the spectators at an event want to expierence.

Correct me if I'm wrong) but the sportsman classes (as far as I know) are not generating the majority of the revenue at the track, and certainly not on television (hence you won't hear or see anything about them on ESPN). Therefore I would not say that the NHRA national event is a participant driven sport (at least today).

On another note, this thread has made me think alot about what I would like the future of the NHRA to be. I remember when first going to races in the mid 90's at Columbus following the points closely as the season went on. Not only was I interested in the individual race, I was interested in the championchip as a whole. Nowadays, I really don't care about the points chase. When I'm in Brainerd in a few weeks, I won't remember (or care) about the points chase before or after the race (and I havent missed a race on tv all year). I think in the future, the championship is going to me meaningless - and thats OK with me.

It seems that there are only 8 fuel cars running for the championship. And maybe half of those have the budget and resources to actually be contenders. Thats 2 each class (Schumacher and Dixon in TF, Force and Force in FC). Its not all about skill like it was back in the day, its all about money and resources.

So whats the big accomplishment if you win the championship... Al-Anabi went out and bought the best of the best, runs the best parts, best driver, best crew chiefs, Alan Johnson. The Force camp is running 3 fuel cars and has seemingly unlimited budget - similar to the Schumacher camp in TF. I guess the only interesting thing to watch as far as the championship is concerned is seeing if any of the above mentioned teams can fall apart at the end of the year.

Its like the sport is evolving into a traveling circus style event. Looks like the IHRA recognized this and is moving forward. I guess that is OK with me as well, as long as they continue to stop in Brainerd for one weekend a year and keep it entertaining.
 
..................Like someone else said kids today just think of cars as another appliance...a means to get from point A to point B. There is no "love-affair" with today's car.

I beg to differ on this, kids are still as crazy about their cars today as they were back in the 60's and 70's. It's just that most on this board, (or the current NHRA demographic) won't give them the time of day and just call them out as "Ricers". These kids are making the best with what they have, but the interest is definitely there. NHRA attempted to bring them into their market with the Import Series, but somehow failed at it. They should have combined the Import Series with the Sportman Divisional Meets and turned those into bigger productions.
 
I beg to differ on this, kids are still as crazy about their cars today as they were back in the 60's and 70's. It's just that most on this board, (or the current NHRA demographic) won't give them the time of day and just call them out as "Ricers". These kids are making the best with what they have, but the interest is definitely there. NHRA attempted to bring them into their market with the Import Series, but somehow failed at it. They should have combined the Import Series with the Sportman Divisional Meets and turned those into bigger productions.

Lance the sport compact Drag scene died on it's own! With the rise of Drifting, and the Sky-high costs of building a Pro FWD or RWD and the lack of sponsorships, the sport just withered away.
 
Lance the sport compact Drag scene died on it's own! With the rise of Drifting, and the Sky-high costs of building a Pro FWD or RWD and the lack of sponsorships, the sport just withered away.

Thank God

Econo-cars are not going to fill any seats unless you offer Rap music, gaudy "midway" full of parts, and half naked "women" in a foam pit.

They had their own chance, and died on their own too.

As far as ticket prices, go to a nastycar race, INDY, or something else along those lines. I think $50+- for a full day of drag racing beats the higher $ amount for just a few hours of round,,,,, there they go....around..... there they go again.....around.....and so on and so on ...any day.
 
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