is the high elevation really that bad at Bandimere? (1 Viewer)

[jim]

Every Mile High Nationals, the TV announcers make such a fuss over the 5800' elevation at Bandimere.

Does the 100% Nitro help in the Nitro classes at least?
Doesn't the thin air reduce air drag and help make up for the reduced HP?
In the end, don't they end up running some pretty respectable times/speeds anyway?

 

[Bullet]

Every Mile High Nationals, the TV announcers make such a fuss over the 5800' elevation at Bandimere.

Does the 100% Nitro help in the Nitro classes at least?
Doesn't the thin air reduce air drag and help make up for the reduced HP?
In the end, don't they end up running some pretty respectable times/speeds anyway?

The Pro Stock cars take the biggest hit as they can't compensate for the lack of oxygen by upping the boost as the supercharged cars can.

With the Fuel cars the thinner air actually results in less drag and downforce which results in less load on the motor and less traction which contributes to the slower ET's.

 

[Rollout96]

It also seems like they mentioned more trouble getting the chutes to deploy up there. I would think at those speeds it wouldn't matter but I think they commented on that in years gone by.

 

[stanman]

You guys typing more than a one word answer are wasting time. The answer to the question is...

YES!!

 

[Lori]

From what I have been told, YES!!!!

 

[jim]

It also seems like they mentioned more trouble getting the chutes to deploy up there. I would think at those speeds it wouldn't matter but I think they commented on that in years gone by.

Last year during the Nats, I was surprised when Mike (not Paul) said a racer's chute(s) didn't deploy, possibly because of thin air. I guess that can happen, but that time the chute containers never even opened. I guess he and Paul don't have a monitor on every camera in use, because sometimes it seems they don't see the final TV picture.

 

[Terry]

You guys typing more than a one word answer are wasting time. The answer to the question is...

YES!!

I second that, Greg. I love to run at Bandimere, but there definitely is a drop off in performance. My home track here in Nebraska is at 2310 feet, and when we go to Bandimere, our rule of thumb is that you will fall off about 6 tenths if you made the right changes. If you fall off more than that, you goofed--if you pick up (don't laugh, I have seen it happen!) you obviously had a fubar setup back home.
Super gas index goes from the sea level 9.90 to the 10.53 at Denver.
Yes, for the normally aspirated group, there is quite a dropoff in et. My first launch at Bandimere, I always nearly lift cause it feels like something has gone south powerwise in the car--but you adapt to it very quickly, and the neat part about it is the next race you go after Bandimere, it really seems like your car hauls a$$!

 

[none]

I loved W.J.s comment one year at Bandimere.
"When you see the birds walking you know it's bad"

 

[Buzzz Miller]

It does not help that the Mile Highs are at a very hot time weather wise. The 90+ degree heat makes the air in the 10,000 range adjusted.

 

[Old Sg]

We have been racing in Denver for 30+ years. The air is bad, nothing at all like sea level. We generally go 4 steps richer in main jetting when going to sea level. In 2006 at the Mile Highs we showed a Density Altitude of 10,098 ft. on Sunday @ 3:09 pm. My son's T/D car runs 7.20 @ 186 @ 7500 ft D/A at sea level that would convert to 6.83 @ 196.
Warren is correct the birds just walk around on the ground here.

 

[BaldyLochs]

It is very noticeable. Even with a good, higher-end everyday street car you can tell a marked difference in performance. Once I drove my fromer car, Saab 9-3 down to Fort Worth, and I was really surprised how much better it ran down there with absolutely no mods.

As for the race cars, last year at Bandimere on Saturday afternoon between sessions, Hillary Will's Dad told me that JimO & Troy were crunching the numbers - based on a corrected altitude of close to 13,000 feet with the heat factored in.

 

[Toejam]

When it's over 85 degrees at Bandimere, the corrected's around 10,000 ft!

 

[HEMI6point1]

Well at least the all-concrete surface and cooling pipes should help this year...

 

[Toejam]

Well at least the all-concrete surface and cooling pipes should help this year...

The Cooling pipes would be a big help if they went past 60'.

 

[Jenn]

Well at least the all-concrete surface and cooling pipes should help this year...

I could be wrong but I don't think the all-concrete surface, nor the cooling pipes help inject oxygen into the atmosphere.

The lack of oxygen/ plus density altitude was/ and is the only real difference in the track itself. You can take the same concrete as a super track and move it over to the mountain and you'll still be stuck with little oxygen for the normally aspirated cars.

 

[john]

They get to run the blower around 20% faster and it still can't make up for the altitude with 100% nitro.

Yes, it makes a big difference. And if your not real good up there, you can get real lost in a hurry.

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

To quantify the difference with the fuel cars, all you have to do is count the blowers that lift the entire manifold. Better have your shoes off, however.

 

[vegasnitro]

I have also heard that tuning on the mountain is counter-intuitive. Even though you are spinning the blower faster, you slow the fuel pump down and put LESS fuel in the cylinder. The theory being that you have to speed the blower up and pump less fuel to it to maintain the same mixture that you would have at regular altitudes.

 

[BaldyLochs]

That's what makes Denver such a unique race. NOBODY runs thier car here like they do anywhere else. They change just about everything but the paint jobs. Aside from the pure sportsmanship and mechanical challenge, you have a top notch facility that is absolutely relentless in thier pursuit of giving every single ticket-buyer thier money's worth. Not just at the nationals, but all year long. It all shakes out to be just a wonderful experience.
Heck, I know I'm nuts; but I actually think it'd be kind of exciting to see the race moved to a little bit later in the tour, make it to where it's a "Countdown" track. (Granted not too late, becuase at the Denver airport in the past, we've deiced planes here.... before Labor Day!)

 

[Stevens24]

And it will probably snow at the track tonightMay 12th and snow down to 6500 ft.