Bross Hawg
Nitro Member
Even Ron Capps mentioned it on FB. Something about if the roles were reversed there'd probably be an FBI investigation.
I'm surprised the Don hasn't paid for an FBI investigation into why Capps's car won't run....
Thiel was not treated fairly (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter fatcat
- Start date
I'm surprised the Don hasn't paid for an FBI investigation into why Capps's car won't run....
It wasn`t only a brain fart,it was grounds for disqualification.You can not touch a car after the first stage light is lit.
Bullard Anderson
Nitro Member
In all fairness what transpired during the race is immaterial. I don't care about Force's 4.11 and the budget vs. Mr. Theil. Everything should have been equal until the green bulb hit.
If John stayed out and Theil jumped in it could have been Force on the trailer and that would have been a problem too. It still would be an issue in my eyes.
I agree there's a 99.9% chance Theil would have lost this race but both he and Force were part of another tree issue in 2011 and neither is deserving of that.
indidad- The Guy- Uncle Steve
Nitro Member
How so?
If the timer was started by the beam actuation, how would it have been any different if the tire that tripped it was on any other car?
For starters,the entire ESPN staff and camera crew would have been at Force's pit making a story out of it.
Gordon
Nitro Member
The only thing that would've been any different is that Force would've been more boisterous in his disdain for the issue, if for no other reason than to get air time for his sponsors. We've seen this before, it's nothing new. (Jeg & Greg in Seattle a while back, if memory serves me right) I'm confident Force didn't do it intentionally, but I'm sorry, for Brian's sake, that he did. It's just a racin' deal.
Did Thiel have an 11 in the tank? We'll never know, will we? Would Bode have won Brainerd, or two rounds in Houston, if all the races were done on paper? Absolutely not. As a paying fan, I want the race decided on the track, not because of a system "fault" that could be made better as referred to below.
I will say this - Kudos to Brian on handling the post race interview with respect and dignity. He was clearly upset about it, and he let that be known, but he did it as calmly and politely as he could given the situation.
And kudos to ESPN for giving him the opportunity. How many times have we seen the low buck racer ignored, regardless of performance, because they felt the need (perceived or otherwise) to show the higher budgeted teams instead.
Bummer deal, no doubt. I like the idea of shortening the time-out to six seconds while not starting the clock until a car is fully staged for a full second.
Congrats to Brian for making the show & I, for one, can't wait to see you out there again!
yoda
Nitro Member
Just watched it on ESPN360, and got out the stopwatch... John's in-and-out absolutely triggered the 7 second clock to start, and he got REALLY lucky to get back in with about a second and a half to go (both cars sat in pre-stage for a little over 4 seconds). Theil wouldn't have seen JF's flash-in, and was definately not expecting the tree when John went back in- count clock already activated.
That being said, Johnny West should never have had hands on the car after the light was lit... A total "DOH" moment on his part- had his boy gotten in, he would have never been in the "safe spot" (in the paint on the left or right of the lane), and would NOT have made it out of harms way if Brian had launched early- say, when he saw the light (red) flash at the bottom of the tree...
Yes Mike, it does. I thought thats why he got bounced and was pretty surprised that Dunn didn't pick up on it quickly. In fact, once Stewart pointed at his watch, that was the "reasoning". I watched it over again a few times and its a sad situation, but the right call was made by the computer.
Force's stage "blink" started the timer. If Force had not pulled in within the alotted time, he too would have been timed out.
What should happen is a "guard" be placed in the software for something like this. Basically write a script that the first to stage has to be on for a certain amount of time before the actual timer begins....something like 1.5-2.0 seconds would suffice. This would give an "oops" moment like Force's a chance to happen, but not upset the timing.
On the other hand, West should not have touched the car....but that rule is interpretted differently also....what about a crew member turning on the computer once both cars are staged..............same thing.
Randy
Nitro Member
"Autostart". Removing responsibility for Chistmas Tree screw ups one race at a time.
They are already paying Stewart to hold the box and make it look like he flips the switch (which he doesn't) to start the race. They need to get rid of autostart and let the starter be a starter. Somewhere Buster is just shaking his head.
RG
They are already paying Stewart to hold the box and make it look like he flips the switch (which he doesn't) to start the race. They need to get rid of autostart and let the starter be a starter. Somewhere Buster is just shaking his head.
RG
yoda
Nitro Member
no kidding!!
TR
Nitro Member
Well, ESPN went to Thiel's pit, but he chose not to make a story out of it. If you want to be heard, you better damn well say something. Since he didn't, I guess he was OK with what happened
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Where's the "Like" button?
Thats the button Stewart pushes.
First you would have to hire a starter. The one they have now is only missing the big red nose and the big floppy shoes.
Totally agree John. I'm hoping that Rick will be retiring sometime soon, but then again, I don't think a new starter will change anything given the powers that be!
my friends call me Zappy
Nitro Member
Mr. Thiel is human, lets give him a break. It's called driver error, thats all.
For some reason he lifted his hatch, after John pre-staged, then pre-staged himself, (hatch still up ).
Next John flickerd the staged light. Autostart activated as it is set up to, starting the 7 seconds. Both cars sit. John finally stages, just before timing out himself. The tree cycled yellow-green. Brian never staged, thus the time out.
It's clear John also was'nt ready, (1.29 RT ) so he didn't know the timer had started either.(John should know better)
A bummer for Thiel yes, but he was not mistreated. The system worked as set up.
For some reason he lifted his hatch, after John pre-staged, then pre-staged himself, (hatch still up ).
Next John flickerd the staged light. Autostart activated as it is set up to, starting the 7 seconds. Both cars sit. John finally stages, just before timing out himself. The tree cycled yellow-green. Brian never staged, thus the time out.
It's clear John also was'nt ready, (1.29 RT ) so he didn't know the timer had started either.(John should know better)
A bummer for Thiel yes, but he was not mistreated. The system worked as set up.
First off it was a tree screw-up... Autostart is not supposed to start with a flicker of the tree...
Both drivers should have been DQ'd... Thiel for touching the car in the beams and Force for backing out of the beams... If the flicker started autostart, John should have been DQ'd for backing out... But since it was Force he was allowed to take the run...
Both drivers should have been DQ'd... Thiel for touching the car in the beams and Force for backing out of the beams... If the flicker started autostart, John should have been DQ'd for backing out... But since it was Force he was allowed to take the run...
MM
Nitro Member
Force did not "back" out of the beams Eric. The car rocked out. There is so much vibration and harmonics, this type of thing happens all the time. This whole argument of "It was Force, so he was allowed to break the rules" doesn't hold water at all. This was not a human choice, it was the autostart computer, and computers are oblivious to who is racing!
