Who makes the best cam and valvetrain parts? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Mooseman
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"Dr. Dirt"
Nitro Member
Re: Who makes the best cam and valve-train parts?
We have a number of engines with Jesel valve-train equipment and I'm not sure that there is any better on the market. Camshafts all come from a couple core manufacturers with the company's grind. We have Herbert grind to our requested specs and we've been quite pleased. Again, there will be product preference based upon experience.
We did accidentally run a 565 BBC to 11,000 at Las Vegas last year. One rocker stand was loose but no parts were broken.
We have a number of engines with Jesel valve-train equipment and I'm not sure that there is any better on the market. Camshafts all come from a couple core manufacturers with the company's grind. We have Herbert grind to our requested specs and we've been quite pleased. Again, there will be product preference based upon experience.
We did accidentally run a 565 BBC to 11,000 at Las Vegas last year. One rocker stand was loose but no parts were broken.
I ran Engle cams for years and always had good luck with them. I was building mostly big inch VW air cooled drag and midget type engines. I am not sure if they have kept up with the times with V8 stuff. I don't think that you can ever go wrong running Crower cam and components. Top quality across the board. I think there are quite a few Nextel Cup teams that use alot of Crower components. If it holds up for them, thats a pretty good indication of its quality.
sharkman
Nitro Member
My Brother runs Engle cams in his BB Olds engines, they are ground to Joe Mondellos specs, never a problem, I prefer Crower but I run SB Chevy stuff.
millertime
Nitro Member
The next question is: What is your application, and how much are you looking to spend? If you are looking for a basic cam for a street engine, most all builders can meet those requirements. It's the exotic valve lift and high-rpm issues that will really separate the claims from reality. Perhaps if fellow maters had more of an idea on what type of engine you were building, we could provide you with more definitive answers. The Doctor is right about Jesel products. When you look at Nascar teams with unlimited budgets, but very tight rules...many of those teams will run Jesel or T&D valvetrain equipment to extremely high rpm's for extended periods of time. As much as we may not agree w/ turning left, there's no disagreement with a flat-tappet cam running 8500 rpm for 500 miles, ya know?
"Dr. Dirt"
Nitro Member
Welcome to the Mater Gary.
sharkman
Nitro Member
If it's for the street then any number of companies build reliable cam and valvetrain components, seriously, I built a nice smallblock Chevy with a Summit K-1107 cam and lifter kit, for a little less than a hundred bucks it did a very good job, on the street it sounded great and and ran kickass! for my racing applications it's Crower cams all the way, the money is well spent. Crower cranks, rods, valve train components, Ross pistons, Dart heads, MSD ignition and Holley carbs, I have yet to lose an engine to part failure with this combo.
Outlaw Eric
Nitro Member
We have had good results with Lunati and Harland Sharp on our BBC.
Custom Speed Parts - The finest aluminum rocker arms for racing engines since 1960.
www.lunaticamshafts.com
I think it depends on your application as some companies are better than others either in value or product depending on your needs.
Custom Speed Parts - The finest aluminum rocker arms for racing engines since 1960.
www.lunaticamshafts.com
I think it depends on your application as some companies are better than others either in value or product depending on your needs.
whyisthisarequiredfield
Nitro Member
I sold hundreds of those things when I worked for Summit Racing. $79.99 at the time (~1995), and included cam and lifters.
Little known fact...they were Crane components.
BTW, I like the avatar. We just visited some friends in Texas last month, and toured the Alamo. Quite an experience.
scotty
Nitro Member
Hard to argue with Crower cams for all your valvetrain needs. They do everything well: cams, lifters, springs, pushrods, rockers, retainers, etc. All of very high quality. For the street their hydraulic grinds sounded KILLER and ran better than most....most.
For our engines we use a variety of manufacturers but a lot of them would be overkill for your needs unless you want to turn that 318 towards "midnite".
For rockers and belt drive we use Jesel and have zero complaints. For non-shaft rockers Crane or Crower would be the top.
Springs and retainers are pretty opinionated because there are a lot of good ones, but Manley and LSM has served our needs well. Again Crower wouldn't be a bad choice.
Valves would be Ferrea, or CV.
Lifters are Crower Severe duty.
Pushrods would be Manton, or Jesel.
And now...cams....the old ULTRADYNE. Harold Brookshire is a genius with opening and closing a valve. He was at Lunati with their "voodoo" series, but he left there as well. In the early days when we tried a lot of things, EVERY engine we ever put together has picked up with his grinds. Now we just use his stuff exclusively. I would put Crower at a close second to him.
Have fun.
For our engines we use a variety of manufacturers but a lot of them would be overkill for your needs unless you want to turn that 318 towards "midnite".
For rockers and belt drive we use Jesel and have zero complaints. For non-shaft rockers Crane or Crower would be the top.
Springs and retainers are pretty opinionated because there are a lot of good ones, but Manley and LSM has served our needs well. Again Crower wouldn't be a bad choice.
Valves would be Ferrea, or CV.
Lifters are Crower Severe duty.
Pushrods would be Manton, or Jesel.
And now...cams....the old ULTRADYNE. Harold Brookshire is a genius with opening and closing a valve. He was at Lunati with their "voodoo" series, but he left there as well. In the early days when we tried a lot of things, EVERY engine we ever put together has picked up with his grinds. Now we just use his stuff exclusively. I would put Crower at a close second to him.
Have fun.
Rockers - Jesel or T&D
Pushrod - Manton or Trend
Lifters - Crower Severe Duty or the new Crane Pro Series
Cams - all about the same, find a grind that works for your combo
Oregon Cam grinders built the cam in my motor off specs from a cam that Rick Santos had made for another one of our motors... excellent work, great price!
Pushrod - Manton or Trend
Lifters - Crower Severe Duty or the new Crane Pro Series
Cams - all about the same, find a grind that works for your combo
Oregon Cam grinders built the cam in my motor off specs from a cam that Rick Santos had made for another one of our motors... excellent work, great price!
Fireball
Nitro Member
I bought a Summit cam for my AMX after reading this. $74.95 w/lifters.
Camshaft Machine Company (CMC) located in Jackson, Michigan was established in 1942 and is probably the largest designer and manufacturer of automotive camshafts in the world. CMC produces cams for GM, Ford, Chrysler, Comp Cams, Lunati, Edlebrock, Crane, Wolverine and many others.
Most (but not all) of the automotive camshafts produced today are produced at one of the “Big Three” cam manufacturers all located in Michigan. CMC of Jackson, MI., Engine Power Components (EPC) of Muskegon, MI., and Waver Bartel Cam Company, of Grand Haven, MI.
CMC purchased Wolverine approximately 1990/1991.
Crane Cams purchased CMC around 1995 and Wolverine was included in this purchase. During this period Crane owned both Wolverine and CMC.
Crane sold CMC to Federal Mogul about April or May of 1999. Crane did not sell Wolverine to Federal Mogul and Crane still owns Wolverine. Federal Mogul also owns the Waver Martel Cam Company.
CMC was the OEM supplier for most of the muscle car cams for GM, Ford, Chrysler and others back in the muscle car era. This included the infamous 9779067, 9779068, 9779041 etc. CMC currently supplies many cams to the OEM manufacturers and holds copyrights for many OEM grinds. If you purchase a Pontiac “original” muscle car grind like the 068 for an example, no matter whom you purchase it from it will be made by CMC.
Another interesting tid bit is that some time prior to 1990 when Crane and Wolverine were competitors Crane developed their own version of the Pontiac 9779068 (and maybe others) but advertised it as a computer enhanced version and not an exact duplicate. The reason that Crane did not produce an exact duplicate is because CMC still holds copyrights to this cam and many others.
Wolverine does not have their own cam grinding shop. CMC supplies most of the grinds to Wolverine. Crane also grinds some of Wolverine cams.
Even though Crane has their own cam grinding shop CMC still grinds some of the cams sold under the Crane name. Crane currently has the contract for the Summit brand cams. Crane also grinds some cams sold under the Wolverine name. Those Summit cams could be produced by CMC or Crane, hence the rumored Wolverine Summit connection.
It has been rumored that Crane makes all Wolverine Cams and this is not true. Most of the cams sold under the Wolverine name are produced by CMC. It is true that a small percentage of cams sold under the Wolverine name are produced at the Crane manufacturing facility. To complicate things further it seems that certain grinds could be purchased under the Crane or Wolverine name that are the exact same grind, and CMC or Crane depending on the grind could have produced the cam.
It’s interesting that most people have not heard of CMC, EPC, or Waver Bartel even though they have been around for a very long time, longer than a lot of us have.
Not much will change now that Federal Mogul owns CMC. They will still produce the same cams and will pretty much supply them to the same customers sold under various nameplates. Federal Mogul recently acquired the TRW automotive products division also. The infamous TRW forged pistons that are so popular with we Pontiac folks are still produced at the same factory as when they were owned by TRW. Federal mogul also now owns seal Power. Federal Mogul also purchased the Clevite Bearing company. This gave Federal Mogul an almost airtight grip on the automotive bearing industry. This created an unfair marketing advantage and the Federal trade Commission (FTC) required Federal Mogul to sell Clevite, which they have done.
So the next time you buy your new Comp Cams, Lunati, Ultradyne, Iskenderian, Engle, or other cam there is a good chance it was actually made in Michigan at one of the top three cam makers. What the cam companies do is have their proprietary grinds (design, lob profile etc.) and have them ground by one of the big three. Very few cams are actually ground by a name brand cam company, Crane is one exception but they don’t grind all of theirs either.
Camshaft Machine Company (CMC) located in Jackson, Michigan was established in 1942 and is probably the largest designer and manufacturer of automotive camshafts in the world. CMC produces cams for GM, Ford, Chrysler, Comp Cams, Lunati, Edlebrock, Crane, Wolverine and many others.
Most (but not all) of the automotive camshafts produced today are produced at one of the “Big Three” cam manufacturers all located in Michigan. CMC of Jackson, MI., Engine Power Components (EPC) of Muskegon, MI., and Waver Bartel Cam Company, of Grand Haven, MI.
CMC purchased Wolverine approximately 1990/1991.
Crane Cams purchased CMC around 1995 and Wolverine was included in this purchase. During this period Crane owned both Wolverine and CMC.
Crane sold CMC to Federal Mogul about April or May of 1999. Crane did not sell Wolverine to Federal Mogul and Crane still owns Wolverine. Federal Mogul also owns the Waver Martel Cam Company.
CMC was the OEM supplier for most of the muscle car cams for GM, Ford, Chrysler and others back in the muscle car era. This included the infamous 9779067, 9779068, 9779041 etc. CMC currently supplies many cams to the OEM manufacturers and holds copyrights for many OEM grinds. If you purchase a Pontiac “original” muscle car grind like the 068 for an example, no matter whom you purchase it from it will be made by CMC.
Another interesting tid bit is that some time prior to 1990 when Crane and Wolverine were competitors Crane developed their own version of the Pontiac 9779068 (and maybe others) but advertised it as a computer enhanced version and not an exact duplicate. The reason that Crane did not produce an exact duplicate is because CMC still holds copyrights to this cam and many others.
Wolverine does not have their own cam grinding shop. CMC supplies most of the grinds to Wolverine. Crane also grinds some of Wolverine cams.
Even though Crane has their own cam grinding shop CMC still grinds some of the cams sold under the Crane name. Crane currently has the contract for the Summit brand cams. Crane also grinds some cams sold under the Wolverine name. Those Summit cams could be produced by CMC or Crane, hence the rumored Wolverine Summit connection.
It has been rumored that Crane makes all Wolverine Cams and this is not true. Most of the cams sold under the Wolverine name are produced by CMC. It is true that a small percentage of cams sold under the Wolverine name are produced at the Crane manufacturing facility. To complicate things further it seems that certain grinds could be purchased under the Crane or Wolverine name that are the exact same grind, and CMC or Crane depending on the grind could have produced the cam.
It’s interesting that most people have not heard of CMC, EPC, or Waver Bartel even though they have been around for a very long time, longer than a lot of us have.
Not much will change now that Federal Mogul owns CMC. They will still produce the same cams and will pretty much supply them to the same customers sold under various nameplates. Federal Mogul recently acquired the TRW automotive products division also. The infamous TRW forged pistons that are so popular with we Pontiac folks are still produced at the same factory as when they were owned by TRW. Federal mogul also now owns seal Power. Federal Mogul also purchased the Clevite Bearing company. This gave Federal Mogul an almost airtight grip on the automotive bearing industry. This created an unfair marketing advantage and the Federal trade Commission (FTC) required Federal Mogul to sell Clevite, which they have done.
So the next time you buy your new Comp Cams, Lunati, Ultradyne, Iskenderian, Engle, or other cam there is a good chance it was actually made in Michigan at one of the top three cam makers. What the cam companies do is have their proprietary grinds (design, lob profile etc.) and have them ground by one of the big three. Very few cams are actually ground by a name brand cam company, Crane is one exception but they don’t grind all of theirs either.
Gary H
Nitro Member
To me, on a street car, break in is more important than who made the cam. If it's a flat tappet cam, get some of GM's EOS or other oil with zinc.
http://www.cranecams.com/pdf/548e.pdf
I've always had good luck with comp cams, but I'm going to run crower HIPPO roller lifters.
BTW, what ever happended to Lazer cams?
Oops, forgot Bill Metzger passed right before christmas...
http://www.cranecams.com/pdf/548e.pdf
I've always had good luck with comp cams, but I'm going to run crower HIPPO roller lifters.
BTW, what ever happended to Lazer cams?
Oops, forgot Bill Metzger passed right before christmas...
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