Dive - Dive - Dive !!!!!!!! (1 Viewer)

[PJ]

exactly. motorsports in general has so long been known for season long points
battles; now we have NASCAR & NHRA throwing the proverbial "fork in the road": it's a tough pill to swallow, but I really think both these two sanc. bodies have realized one of the keys, if not THE key to increasing revenue, is to maximize excitement surrounding each individual race in the series.
With a manipulation of the points, that alone is one common thread that adds
excitement earlier in the year and follows through to the end.
Yes, it's a gimic, but if it brings more exposure and sponsor $$ to the sport,
who's the better for it? I would say everyone is.
I can't find the article on comp. plus and I read it earlier today, but read
Jim Head's comments about some of the pro teams dying, some just at
greater rates than others.

The key is gimmicks are short term, people wear out on gimmicks then they shuffle off to see the next shinny object down the road. If you want true growth then you don't need gimmicks. I don't believe in mortgaging the soul and integrity of a sport to gain a few people for a short time. I do appreciate that NHRA is trying to do something to increase the number of fans but this is not the right move.

Since we're copying nascar on this lets look at how they have done. The first year of the chase did see a jump in numbers. However it has gone backwards every year since. Currently TV ratings are down 9% from last year and 20% from 2 years ago. They have already changed how they run the points for this year. How does that look to last years champ? When people look back at championship now they have to figure out what year it was to know how it was determined?

Give me real honest racing, no BS, no games, no timeouts or redo's. Best person wins.




As for the champ being the one with the most money. Sadly that is part of it. But its not like there is only 1 team out there in each class with deep pockets. The Cagnazzi team has shown that they can stand with KB racing. Allen Johnson is right there as well. Yes team Force is Force both at the track and at the bank but last I looked schumacher is doing very well too. Don't we consider an unsponsored team an underdog? Well let me introduce you to the tf points leader Rod Fuller, who's ahead of such money teams as Bernsteins Beer wagon and Schumacher's ultimate Army car. Money does play a huge roll but flopping stacks of cash on top of the car doesn't make it go faster, you have to know how to use that cash to go fast.


If they want to increase the sport, do night of fire's throughout the country on off race weekends. Send 4 funny cars or dragsters to tracks they don't normally go to. Saturday night show, make a few passes, gain a ton of fans. Have each driver pull 2 of these a year and its spreads the burden out.

Get our merchandise into mass retailers. Yes this may mean working together and possibly some profit sharing (not all of it just some). The more visibility the better.

Have one website for all merchandise of all teams.

Get tv coverage with a more dedicated time slot. Even if it means moving networks. I like the production the espn 2 does but when I have to wait to see drag racing because a scrabble fest is on (that was the case this weekend) it is crazy. Kids are the future of the sport, I became a fan young and have stayed a fan. My oldest 2 kids (5 & 6) are fans but 10pm-1am telecast is just beyond what they can watch. I wonder if a channel like Spike would allow for a dedicated 7-10 timeslot on race weekends?

 

[nick name]

I wonder if a channel like Spike would allow for a dedicated 7-10 timeslot on race weekends?

It's water under the bridge now since NHRA has re-signed with ESPN2, but one of the more amazing things I've heard (from VERY well connected sources) is that Speed TV was willing to PAY for the priviledge of airing races. As part of their pitch, they basically offered NHRA any time they wanted as the base for their show(s) and promotion of the series on a level just behind NASCAR.

I understand the offer was declined because Speed TV wasn't a top tier network (available in the basic package) and didn't have the "credibility or stature" of ESPN. Might be, but they settled for the Deuce and we all know what passes for sports programming there.

 

[PJ]

I can actually understand them not going to speed. I don't remember the numbers but the amount of households that have espn2 versue speed is very large. They would limiting the range of people that they could get right from the start. Thats why a jump to another bigger, well carried network may be a better move for the long term growth. Spike, USA, TNT, foxsports whatever. It just needs to be a large nationally carried network, either that or since we are paying for the espn2 coverage I would think that we could throw some weight as to timeslots....at least when it comes to scrabble

 

[mick]

PJ,
Sometimes your logic is hard to surpass.
For right now though, for some reason I really don't mind the "C".
We'll seel how much politics play into the last 1/3 of the season
and revisit our opinions along the way.
I am convinced though that the sanc. body in conjunction with
the track owners need to maximize the excitement surrounding
each event. As each event grows, so grows the series.

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

I understand diving perfectly. Jeff insured the continuance of his team-mate and increased his personal stock in my portfolio. What I hate is lying about it. If it's to be, make it obvious in support of the one you wish to see advanced. There's lots of ways to do it.

Here's one for you:
Hot Dawg can decide if he'd rather have Herbert or Grubnic in the "countdown" for the remainder of the season. Don't you think scenarios like this are going to come into play? Fact is, we will see team cars eliminated from any possibility of winning the championship diving for others to determine the future field of competitors and when they aren't diving at all, but smoke the tires or go red, the speculation will begin?

 

[Kelly]

I
Here's one for you:
Hot Dawg can decide if he'd rather have Herbert of Grubnic in the "countdown" for the remainder of the season. Don't you think scenarios like this are going to come into play? Fact is, we will see team cars eliminated from any possibility of winning the championship diving for others to determine the future field of competitors and when they aren't diving at all, but smoke the tires or go red, the speculation will begin?

I have actually thought about that as well!

 

[PJ]

I understand diving perfectly. Jeff insured the continuance of his team-mate and increased his personal stock in my portfolio. What I hate is lying about it. If it's to be, make it obvious in support of the one you wish to see advanced. There's lots of ways to do it.

Here's one for you:
Hot Dawg can decide if he'd rather have Herbert of Grubnic in the "countdown" for the remainder of the season. Don't you think scenarios like this are going to come into play? Fact is, we will see team cars eliminated from any possibility of winning the championship diving for others to determine the future field of competitors and when they aren't diving at all, but smoke the tires or go red, the speculation will begin?

I mentioned that somewhere before as well. Rather than a one race sponorship could Herbert offer Rod a one round sponsorship.

From Rod's view I would think he'd rather have Herbert in then Grubby. No knock on the Herbert team but with Grubby he also has the potential to have two blockers helping him. Which could help him amass round wins easier. With Herbrt he's fighting on his own.


I'm sure this isn't what the powers that be wanted when they create this mess but when you don't look at the big picture and all the whats if's you're left with stuff like this. Now not only will we be counting points for the championship the new and old way, people will also be keeping track of dive points. It's almost like the drag racing version of survivior, who's the most liked in the pits. Can they get enough people to dive for them......

 

[PJ]

something else I wonder for the teams already in such as Anderson and Fuller who sitting at#1 really are not doing much sitting there. Plus others like Force, Kurt, Connolly and such that are in and pretty much set in their spot. Whats the advantage to staying?

Season points don't matter now as they're being reset as soon as the event is done. Would heading to Indy to test (and give the teams a break) be better then sitting out the rain for another day or two?

Not saying we're going to see a mass exodous but I bet this is a question at least a few teams have wondered.

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

PJ,
For them it's all about the Wally now!

 

[Rollout96]

I understand diving perfectly. Jeff insured the continuance of his team-mate and increased his personal stock in my portfolio. What I hate is lying about it. If it's to be, make it obvious in support of the one you wish to see advanced. There's lots of ways to do it.

Amen Doc. That is exactly how I feel about it. I understand the business mechanics behind it but NEVER, EVER want to feel lied to or cheated. I really feel the Worshams are "GOOD" people. My dad raced alcohol F/C when Chuck did. We didn't really know them but they were always classy. I think it is obvious that this was a tough decision for them and they were honest about why they made it. I certainly respect that.

 

[mike]

Plus side.... championship locked up by Indy means then people are just racing for the win....

minus side... hype... I really wonder if Glendora understands I could care less who's the Champ... it's who wins and who sets low et and top time...
who wins Indy, The Winters, Gators, Summers(E-town) and the Finals.... not who's champ....

Stop cramming HYPE down our throat, I'm watching the race for the racing, not for who comes out on top at the end of the year....

Amen brother Karl Amen!!!

 

[paoldtimer]

Since we're copying nascar on this lets look at how they have done. The first year of the chase did see a jump in numbers. However it has gone backwards every year since. Currently TV ratings are down 9% from last year and 20% from 2 years ago.

The reason for the decline is due to the LATE race starts to pull in the West Coast fan not because of the CHASE. Most races don't start before 2:00 ET and by then, I'm busy doing things and won't take the time to watch it. But, Sunday night at 7:00 - I'll be there for NHRA.

I can actually understand them not going to speed. I don't remember the numbers but the amount of households that have espn2 versue speed is very large.

Quality vs quantity?? I'll take SPEED Channel any day over ESPN2. At least you will be getting auto-related shows and not have to deal with the Scrabble and Rock/Paper/Scissors Championships...

 

[Gutter Brain]

If Connie, or anyone else "swings for the fences" (whether it is called testing for next year, just laying down a good number, whatever) and takes out someone in the Countdown, are we going to have lots of speculations that they had an alliance with this team or that team?
This sort of got mentioned in another thread. But, I thought better here. Just wonder how much talk we will have here or ESPN2 if someone goes up in smoke or really runs good.

 

[PJ]

good grief there's going to be more speculation and suspicion on every run then there is about Barry Bond's "medicine" cabinet

 

[Gutter Brain]

That was great, PJ. Thanks for the laugh!
Before I get flamed for that, I know there may have been things last year or in the past. But, if we talked this much just getting INTO the Countdown, what will it be like in the last few races.

 

[Billy]

Contrived, manufactured excitement. And diving. Weak, phony bullshit all the way around.

As they say when the weather's bad and no one gets all their runs, everyone's dealing from the same deck. And they knew it from the start of the season. It's not contrived or manufactured. It was stated that this was how the season would play out from the get go. We're just playing Life instead of Monopoly or something to that effect.

 

[PJ]

That was great, PJ. Thanks for the laugh!
Before I get flamed for that, I know there may have been things last year or in the past. But, if we talked this much just getting INTO the Countdown, what will it be like in the last few races.

just because people talk doesn't mean its good, people talked about Anna Nicole Smith alot....doesn't mean people wanted to be her or like her

 

[PJ]

As they say when the weather's bad and no one gets all their runs, everyone's dealing from the same deck. And they knew it from the start of the season. It's not contrived or manufactured. It was stated that this was how the season would play out from the get go. We're just playing Life instead of Monopoly or something to that effect.

true it is the same and everyone knew going in. The contrived and manufactured aspect comes from the fact that this is being done to supposedily make championships closer. At its core this is an effort to stop teams that do too well for too long. Why only bunch them up twice, why not reset the points every few races or why not have a countdown to two.

 

[kingcobrafan]

It's not contrived or manufactured. It was stated that this was how the season would play out from the get go.

Care to tell me how the fact that it was stated from the get go somehow keeps it from being contrived and manufactured? I stand behind every criticism I've posted about the Countdown (oops, SCAMdown. Sorry, PJ). And for that matter, every one of PJ's that I can remember reading. The Glendora bean counters have taken the basic integrity of drag racing, that being stage up and race for the championship with most points winning, and flushed it down the crapper. One opinion that will NEVER change.

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

Me too... sorry to see Mel out. With all the stuff they've thrown at her this year, she gets my vote for character and grace under fire. Wish she could own her own team.

I'm sure Daddy Lucas is thrilled though

My sentiments exactly! Here's one that's not even a moral victory as they all sit in the stands to watch the following rounds finish up? I have no doubts that my sponsor would understand me continuing the final chances of my team-mate Arend style.