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Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

This is a discussion on Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle within the NHRA forum, part of the Pit Area category; Originally Posted by Wes Tarkington Whether Eric's was caused by an internal tire failure or failure from an outside ...


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  #31  
Old 04-01-2007, 11:40 AM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

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Originally Posted by Wes Tarkington View Post
Whether Eric's was caused by an internal tire failure or failure from an outside influence (i.e., debris) the root cause was the tire. Going forward the key issues should be eliminating the propensity for such an event to occur.
That's what I've been saying all along yet a few here have attacked me for it. The tire may have failed on it's own or something may have caused it to fail. Either way, a tire is the only thing on that car that can cause such a massive vibration. A crankshaft or anything else rotating on the car doesn't have the mass and speed to cause a shake that terrible.

We've all seen a washing machine walk across the floor when it's out of balance from one too many pairs of jeans or a couple towels in the wrong spot. Now imagine that pair of jeans weighs 15 or 20lbs and that drum is spinning 300 mph and just think what it was doing inside the cockpit.
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  #32  
Old 04-01-2007, 11:51 AM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

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Originally Posted by Brent Busch View Post
...Either way, a tire is the only thing on that car that can cause such a massive vibration...
What about a wheel failure? I'm not suggesting that was the case here but wouldn't that be another component that is capable of producing astronomical vibration if it failed at speed?
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  #33  
Old 04-01-2007, 11:53 AM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

I'm NOT giving opinions here, just "Asking questions"

1. "IF" as that say it was due to tire vibration, Is it possible that there was a problem with ONLY this one tire.. I'm sure they have quality control when the tires are built.. but could "ONE" bad tire have gotten past inspection?

2. I wonder how many runs (if any) were on "THAT" particular tire.. if it was the first pass.. it could have been just that one tire.. or if it had 2-3 passes on it how did the car perform with it on those runs ?

Just questions that ran through my mind ....
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  #34  
Old 04-01-2007, 11:58 AM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

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Originally Posted by Brent Busch View Post
That's what I've been saying all along yet a few here have attacked me for it. The tire may have failed on it's own or something may have caused it to fail. Either way, a tire is the only thing on that car that can cause such a massive vibration. A crankshaft or anything else rotating on the car doesn't have the mass and speed to cause a shake that terrible.

We've all seen a washing machine walk across the floor when it's out of balance from one too many pairs of jeans or a couple towels in the wrong spot. Now imagine that pair of jeans weighs 15 or 20lbs and that drum is spinning 300 mph and just think what it was doing inside the cockpit.
Let me play devil's advocate. for a moment. We do a couple of washes a day here, and I can't remember the last time the washer got so out of sync that it "walked." Probably because the Maytag machine we have cuts off when the load severely out of balance. That happens a lot. So, perhaps a sensor with a kill switch might be worth looking into, but finding something inherently wrong with the tires is unrealistic because IMHO, it's a confluence of events, i.e. traction, track, tune up, etc. that causes the problem. The tires are just the obvious item that gets noticed.
The manufactures aren't making a fortune selling Drag Tires and could walk away from this business in a heart beat. Perhaps a solution that doesn't throw the tire maker under a bus would be more beneficial.
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  #35  
Old 04-01-2007, 12:23 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

Here we take the one piece of information that we have, which is that tire vibration caused Eric's death, and now we start speculating as to why there was tire vibration. I'm not an engineer, but I do have a Ph. D. and one thing that my training has taught me is not to reach any conclusions based on limited data. Hell, that is why Harry Truman said he wanted an economist with only one arm, so he couldn't say on the other hand. I don't think it's too much to ask to let people find out more about what happened before we start arguing about what should be done. Shouldn't that whole thread about about the need for soft walls tell us something.

Last edited by Dave Ring; 04-01-2007 at 12:34 PM.
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  #36  
Old 04-01-2007, 12:30 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

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Originally Posted by Dave Ring View Post
Here we take the one piece of information that we have, which is that tire vibration caused Eric's death, and now we start speculating as to why there was tire vibration. I'm not an engineer, but I do have a Ph. D. and one thing that my training has taught me is not to reach any conclusions based on limited data. Hell, that is why Harry Truman said he wanted an economist with only one arm, so he couldn't say on the other hand. I don't think it's too much to ask to let people find out more about what happened before we start arguing about what should be done. Shouldn't that whole thread about about the neeed for soft walls tell us something.
OH Dave, please stop making complete sense... Haven't you heard what the Goodyear Tire Press Release said?? Oh yeah, that's right, there hasn't been one yet...
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  #37  
Old 04-01-2007, 12:36 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

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Originally Posted by Ray Ghio Jr View Post
OH Dave, please stop making complete sense... Haven't you heard what the Goodyear Tire Press Release said?? Oh yeah, that's right, there hasn't been one yet...
Their spokeman said the tire failed. It might not have been an official press-release but it came right from the spokeman of the company in his official capacity.
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  #38  
Old 04-01-2007, 12:42 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

No need for soft walls...Let drag racing continue as we know it....on the edge...When I was licensing in alcohol F/C, Densham told me there are two types of racers....those that race and have faith and those that don't and criticize...

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  #39  
Old 04-01-2007, 12:42 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

Seems difficult to me that a tire manufacturer can be blamed for designing a tire that has the capability to give a car the traction it needs to get these absolutely incredible speeds and ETs. This is what the racers wanted from a tire. Now enter the side effects: tire shake, it can be compensated for with chassis tuning so the teams put up with it in exchange for those incredible numbers when they work. Someone recently posted a link to a video that showed an under-funnycar cam aimed at the right rear tire. I have seen the ESPN shots from outside the car but was shocked at the amount of deformity I saw from undercar. This just ain't right for a tire, let alone a tire going 300+. Someone said fix the problem by removing superchargers? I don't think so. If there is a problem with the tire -fix the tire! A stronger tire that won't come apart will surely slow these cars down. Not what I want but what prices are we willing to pay to keep setting records.
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  #40  
Old 04-01-2007, 03:35 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

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I don't mean to hijack this thread but...Can any of you that have experienced tire shake give us,that have never been through it,some sort of reference that we might be able to relate to what it might feel like?
For Alan, and some others I just want to make sure that you know that I was in no way offering an opinion in regards to Eric's crash one way or the other. I don't know really any of the actual facts about it. Someone posted something in regards to tire shake, and my somewhat unique experience with that is something that I wanted to share, because I don't think some folks realize how bad it can truly be. If something similar to that occured in Eric's case, but it wouldn't stop when he lifted as you mentioned Alan, then that makes me sick to even think about.

In regards to your question Mike, the only real comparison is what someone else mentioned....a paintshaker. That is without a doubt EXACTLY what it feels like. Imagine your head being in that machine for about 2 seconds.
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  #41  
Old 04-01-2007, 07:54 PM
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Re: Tire vibration blamed in driver's death-Houston Chronicle

If the tire was out of balance enough to cause a severe vibration, doesn't it seem like a large amount of weight would have to be removed from one side of it?

A truck tire shop near me has a sign stating that a tire that is so many ounces out of balance actually equals several hundred pounds of vibrating pressure at so many MPH, like 65 or something. If a slick had, say, a POUND missing from one side at the MPH they're running?

The solution may end up being like the roll cage shields, for something that may never happen again. A friend and I were discussing this today and saying that maybe they need something softer than the cage padding that's currently mandated. Could be liquid or air filled. I remember in football we had "water" helmets with liquid filled padding. Something that could give so the cage could shake back and forth and the weight of the driver's head and helmet could help make it remain stationary, or closer to it.
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