1000ft drag racing in Denver

#**151** 07-03-2008, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenn Jaramillo

So should they have postponed Denver until they could have found an good "fan approved" method? If it takes more time than that? Cancel the next couple races too?

If you think this action was the only alternative, or that there are no ways to slow these cars down, then let me suggest that you start by read the "Slowing Them Down" thread started by Alan Reinhart. It's not about a "fan approved" method; it's about addressing a serious safety concern even while preserving the integrity and history of the sport. I am concerned that the new 1000 foot rule does little to address the former even as I am convinced that it does serious damage to the latter.

#**152** 07-03-2008, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Smith

If you think this action was the only alternative, or that there are no ways to slow these cars down, then let me suggest that you start by read the "Slowing Them Down" thread started by Alan Reinhart. It's not about a "fan approved" method; it's about addressing a serious safety concern even while preserving the integrity and history of the sport. I am concerned that the new 1000 foot rule does little to address the former even as I am convinced that it does serious damage to the latter.

Don't go and throw wrench into her cap Rich! LOL

#**153** 07-03-2008, 02:12 AM

I will no longer be attending Sonoma, Vegas 1&2, Pomona 1&2 & Phoenix if it remains 1000'

Slow them down and maintain the integrity of the sport and its current records.

#**154** 07-03-2008, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Smith

I am glad you raised the issue because you make a very valid argument. In fact I think you hit upon one of the major differences between circle track racing and drag racing. In NASCAR, for example, fans prefer variety of tracks and decry the so-called "cookie cutter" tracks that are near carbon copies of other tracks. In NASCAR a championship racer has to be good on everything from short tracks to intermediate tracks to super speedways to road courses. Variety is the name of the game. Likewise, in sprint car racing no two dirt tracks are exactly the same. Even at the same track the condition of the track itself can change from one day to the next - and sometimes even in the same night. The ability to adapt to various tracks and track conditions are a major part of what dirt racing is all about. Drag racing of course also requires adaptation to changing track conditions. But unlike NASCAR or sprint car racing, the track has always been the same length. In that sense drag racing is more like football where the field is always the same size even if the conditions on the field may vary depending on weather, type of turf, etc. Sprint car racing is more akin to baseball where the dimensions of the field very from stadium to stadium. The problem is that drag racing has been 1/4 mile since the very beginning of the sport. One cannot simply alter the length of a race without also effecting all the stats and data that has accumulated over the entire history of the sport. Because of that what we will be seeing starting with Denver will be fundamentally different than what we have seen in drag racing for more than 50 years.

Thanks for that response Rich. I really do appreciate it. I agree with your perspective concerning both paved and dirt track oval and road course racing.

Already this year, I have worked races at two 1/8th drag strips that have been open for drag racing for 50 years. The quarter mile has not been the only legitimate form of drag racing. While it (1320') has been the most common distance available in many areas of the country, shorter tracks have also been (and will continue to be) an important segment of the sport for a very long time. While you aren't accustomed to a shorter racing surface being placed upon two Professional classes, I don't believe the differences are of enough significance for anyone to abandon the sport entirely. Give it a look. If you still don't like what you see, then walk away.

FWIW, the change is gonna be a pain in the butt for myself and my colleagues. We work with a historic database concerning personal best performances, as well as trying to acknowledge track and and national event record performances. The change will mean building a new database from ground zero. I still believe this is a positive move.

I'm not so blind as to think that this will prevent every catastrophic crash resulting in a fatality in the future, but I do believe it will go a long way toward reducing them. I absolutely hate it when a racer dies while racing.

#**155** 07-03-2008, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Sherwood

How long before the crewchiefs learn just how much more they can throw at these motors in 3.9 secs they couldn't in 4.5? More mag, static compression, you can bet your ass that AJ and Coil will do that! What happens when we start seeing more boomers at 1/8 mile we used to see at 1000'? Will Jim Head talk about the carnage suffered past 1/8 mile and how dangerous 1000 racing is? This is only the beginning, I see 1/8 mile becoming the standard in 5 years!

I'll say it for the second time. Due to the rev limiters, they already were throwing everything they had to get to the point where the rev limiters kicked in. Boomers at the 1/8th mile? Ask Herbert about boomers at the starting line.

#**156** 07-03-2008, 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenn Jaramillo

So it was never about the close racing, spectacular speeds, and record E.T.s.

It's all about the extra 320 feet!

Someone who gets it. Thanks Jenn!

#**157** 07-03-2008, 03:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenn Jaramillo

So it was never about the close racing, spectacular speeds, and record E.T.s.

It's all about the extra 320 feet!

And Arena Football has punting, blocking, tackles, and touchdowns just like the NFL. They both call themselves football so means they're both the same, right?

#**158** 07-03-2008, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Smith

If you think this action was the only alternative, or that there are no ways to slow these cars down, then let me suggest that you start by read the "Slowing Them Down" thread started by Alan Reinhart. It's not about a "fan approved" method; it's about addressing a serious safety concern even while preserving the integrity and history of the sport. I am concerned that the new 1000 foot rule does little to address the former even as I am convinced that it does serious damage to the latter.

Is it the only alternative, no. We have 8 days til the start of the Mile Highs. There's no testing 7 days at a facility before the event. There's a nitro shortage. Diesal isn't cheap. The fuel racers have just had a hard hitting lesson about the importance of spending qaulity time with their families.

This is the cheapest, fastest alternative that won't really require addtional testing, won't incur extra money on all the teams, it may even save them some.

Bandimere speedway has a new racing surface and it's first rate. Temp controlled from water that's designed to be be there, and smooth. Bumps that were there before, aren't there now, it's got a longer concrete pad, full 1320 if I'm not mistaken. Some of the track data that teams had before may be not usable if they were tuning for bumps in the track/transition area.

#**159** 07-03-2008, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Smith

And Arena Football has punting, blocking, tackles, and touchdowns just like the NFL. They both call themselves football so means they're both the same, right?

Not the same, just different challenges

.

I was watching the baseball training video at my brothers house and they did something that I thought was pretty neat and I think it can apply here.

Pitchers and batters are usually at a set distance every time away from each other, right? This guy has the pitcher throw the ball from different distances, same pitch, just the distance is different. Then they change the pitch and do the different distances all over again. The batter and the pitcher learn how to quickly adjust to the arc of the ball. It test the skills of both the pitcher and batter.

Adding this new variation, and for all we know, this could be a one or two time deal, or it could become permanant on the national event level, will test the skills of driver and tuner. Instead of the arc of the ball, you have fuel curves, instead of the velocity of the ball, you have timers. All of these things that can made the adaptive skills of driver and tuner shine.

Even the catchers (who I could call crew members) had to learn to catch sailing balls, and tossed balls.

#**160** 07-03-2008, 05:07 AM

Glad that they posted this now. Now I won't have to bother ordering my tickets for Maple Grove or Bristol next year.

#**161** 07-03-2008, 06:16 AM

This is why the USA is in the state it is, it isn't willing to adapt!

People must have been saying the same kind of stuff when wearing a seatbelt was law, but that saved countless lives, just look what happened to those two kids earlier this year when they didn't wear theirs.

SUV sales are doing down the toilet because they didn't adapt to the 'green way'. Kids are getting larger and portclosers are growing because people don't think of the consquences of what they eat and what they sign will be later on down the road!

In order to grow sales the general rule is to adapt to changing local, national or international conditions.

Those who don't want to attend events, fine, betting loosing a fan than loosiing a life.

Your moaning loosing 320 feet, but yet attending events instead that use slower cars and differing track lenghs!!? - go figure!

Cheers

James

#**162** 07-03-2008, 07:04 AM

Ya' know, now I AM going to Maple Grove.

Maybe, maybe attendance will be down, heck you guys not going may be doing me a favor.

Better seats and sardine can rows of fans in the hot sun is why I have not gone in the last couple years.

So now I WILL be there.

Parking should be easier too, not to mention getting in and out of that track.

So, attendance may be down, of course if it is all will gnash and wail that it is because of the shorter distance, not the cost of living or anything like that........

.

Once the economy turns around, and people can once again spend their entertainment dollars, the seats will fill again, if it goes back to 1320, and all the drivers, teams, owners, tuners, feel once again that this is safe, safer than it was, I'll be happy too.

See.........I love the sport, and am a happy guy

I do not complain a lot, 'cause I have gratitude.

Life is good, short, and why complain about stuff?

All this is a luxury for us, we lose sight of that. I will always respect the decisions of the doers, the whiners, IMO, can take a hike.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know you will.

Don't let the door hit yer ass on the way out.

REX

#**163** 07-03-2008, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Sherwood

How long before the crewchiefs learn just how much more they can throw at these motors in 3.9 secs they couldn't in 4.5? More mag, static compression, you can bet your ass that AJ and Coil will do that! What happens when we start seeing more boomers at 1/8 mile we used to see at 1000'? Will Jim Head talk about the carnage suffered past 1/8 mile and how dangerous 1000 racing is? This is only the beginning, I see 1/8 mile becoming the standard in 5 years!

well now they'll be blowing up right in front of the stands Joe, instead of past the 1000' mark where most tracks don't let you sit anymore. Like they did in the old days, when they were slower...and more fun.

#**164** 07-03-2008, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Pellegrini

Doesn't mean the fans will be.
If this impacts attendance the way it appears it will I bet you it won't last long!
Fans don't have to let the drivers know anything they just won't show up.
Actions speak louder than words ever could!
Maybe they should reduce driver’s salaries as well as ticket prices to reflect the change.
If this becomes a permanent change I will stop going also I wish I would have known before I just ordered my Sonoma tickets.
I'm with Joe on this issue I will be attending more nostalgia meets in the near future.
Joe goes to a lot of events and he is a dedicated fan and if you gauge his feelings that might be the true feelings of a lot of long time fans not all but a lot!
There are a lot of drivers in waiting that would jump in any vacated seat that becomes available.

This argument doesn't work. Very few drag racing fans are on this board. Having two or three of our members state that they are giving up and packing it in hardly equates to empty stands at Bandimere in next weekend (or anywhere else for that matter). Not to mention that if you explain to most people (please don't take this the wrong way Rich or Joe) the reasoning behind the change and the people behind the change, they would most likely understand. For the sake of conversation, if your doomsday, empty seat scenario were to come to fruition, NHRA might just say "let's give this season up, concentrate on the changes that need to be made, and we'll come back bigger and stronger in '09".

I fully believe that beginning at Pomona 1, 2009 we will be back to quarter mile drag racing for all classes. Limits will be put into place that will keep speeds down. Other rules will be put into place to make things safer. But you can bet your bottom dollar we will never again see 4.40's at 335 mph. Those days are gone, like it or not. NHRA can't impose the type of performance changes necessary to safely slow the cars down RIGHT NOW. It would be unfair to everyone. This was the only option given the timing.

To Rich and Joe: Bravo for standing up for what you believe in. I don't post much (unless I'm truly inspired), but I lurk a ton, and I respect you guys as posters. I don't think you guys will have to stay away for long though.

#**165** 07-03-2008, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Smith

Drag racing has been 1/4 mile from the very beginning of the sport.

Except for where it has been 1/8 mile.

Jim

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